专访·经历篇|Swami Mantramurti：瑜伽让我快乐（
采访：Stella Zhang & 闲人捷
整理：Stella Zhang
翻译：闲人捷
偶遇瑜伽，命中注定
Q: How do you make yoga a part of your life?
问：瑜伽是如何成为您生活的一部分的？
A: Yoga is definitely part of my life.
瑜伽确实是我生命的一部分。
I've made a choice and decision that my life is better and it has more purpose and meaning if I make yoga a part of my life.
我做了选择和抉择让我的生命更美好，让瑜伽进入我的生活有着更多的意义和目的。
But I think it took long time till this happen. It's funny because I don't think I ever choose this.
但是我想这个发生拖了很长的时间。很有趣的是，我从未想过选择这些（瑜伽）。
The first time I went into a yoga center was to be a builder.
我第一次进入瑜伽中心是作为一个建筑师。
I was asked to build the house for the ashram. Ashram is like an Indian concept.
我被邀请去建一个类似印度修习营的中心。
This ashram is in the forest very near to where I lived in Australia.
这个修习营在森林附近离我在澳大利亚的住处很近。
It was set up around 40 years ago by Indians. It is the Indian style of yoga.
是四十多年前由印度人建造，很有印度风格。
So it's strange that I come to Indian style of yoga by accident. Or, meant to be.
所以我进入这个印度风格的修行营是个意外，或许，是命中注定。
It took about 3 months. So I spent a lot of time sitting back and watching everything that the people do.
那个工程大概进行了3个月。所以我有很多机会坐在（教室）后面去观察每一个人在做什么。
They all come and stay there for months or years. These people are living yoga.
他们会在那个（瑜伽中心）待几个月甚至几年，就只是过瑜伽般的生活。
They do classes, some are teachers, some are students and some are just interested and want to understand what is happening.
在课堂上，他们有些是老师，有些是学生，有些人就是对瑜伽有兴趣想知道这些都发生了什么。
And this was what I was surrounded by and watching.
这些观察让我臣服。
At the very beginning, I thought these people were very strange and I didn't want to have any to do with them.
刚开始的时候，我觉得这些人很奇怪，不愿和他们有任何交集。
I would build my house and go away. So when they kept inviting me to come and do some yoga, I said no thank you.
我打算完成这个建筑工程就离开。所以当他们邀请我一起做瑜伽的时候，我说，算了吧，谢谢。
But the one thing that I observed was that even though those people were really weird they were all really happy.
但是，我观察到一件事，这些人确实奇怪，也确实很幸福。
And that made me start to wonder how'd this make them happy.
这些都促使我想知道，什么让他们如此快乐。
Before my leave, they kept inviting me to yoga class.
在我离开之前，他们一直坚持邀请我过来上瑜伽课。
I just refused because I thought myself was already strong and getting strong was the purpose of yoga I understood by then.
我一直拒绝，因为我觉得瑜伽只是能让人强壮而已，而我已经很强壮了。那是我对瑜伽最初的认知。
But in the end, I was about to leave, I thought I should go try one yoga class that can't hurt me.
但是在最后，当我要离开的时候，我想我去试下瑜伽课吧，反正也不会有什么损失。
So I took 2 yoga classes and I could not believe that I felt so good after these yoga classes.
所以我去上了2节瑜伽课，课后，我简直难以置信，感觉太好了！
I wondered may be that was why these people were so happy.
我开始理解，为什么这些人如此幸福了。
And in this time at my life, I have been working for 20 years in business which I was quite successful in.
在这之前，我已经工作了近20年，而且还相当成功。
I was a boss and had many people working for me. But I had a lot of worry and pressure and stress in my life.
我原先是个老板，而且有很多员工。但是我的生活中有很多焦虑和压力。
I realized that money would not bring me happiness so I went to live in the forest to live with nature quietly and try to find some happiness.
我意识到钱并不能给我带来很多快乐，所以我就住在了森林里去亲近自然，希望能找回快乐。
And this was the time when yoga came into my life. In the 2 classes I just did some asana and a little bit of breathing.
这时瑜伽进入了我的生活。在那两节瑜伽课上我仅仅是做了一些体式和呼吸的练习。
That's why I couldn't understand because I thought this was so simple but it really had affect on me.
我不太明白为何这么简单的事会影响到我。
I heard all of the people in this ashram talking they had a yoga course which would take 3 years and teach about the history and philosophy of yoga, the anatomy and how to do the practices.
我听说修习营有一个3年的课程，是关于瑜伽历史、哲学和解剖学，还有瑜伽习练的。
Since I was living 10 minutes away and had plenty of spare time and I enjoyed of study, I decided that I would do this yoga training course.
从我住的地方到这里只需要10分钟，我热爱学习又有充足的时间，所以我决定上这个课程。
So I have lived half of my life very different way.
所以，我的后半生有了不一样的生活。
I started off as an apprentice in a communication company and I worked my way up over 20 years then I became the boss.
我在一家通讯公司实习，用了20年的时间成为老板。
So I understand what it's like to be at bottom and what it's like to come up and to be at the top. It's not a good life style.
所以，我懂得如何从底层做到高层。这不是一个好的生活方式。
Too much money and too much worry.
太多的金钱导致太多的焦虑。
This leads to every night you going out to drink with everybody, you do not eat well, you do not exercise well, gambling and other crazy things.
这导致你夜夜笙歌，吃垃圾食品，不常健身，赌博或是其他疯狂的事。
But if someone had told me then, it's not a way for happiness, I wouldn't have believed them.
不过，如果那时有人和我说，这样不能幸福，我肯定不会相信他的。
We learn everything through our experience in our life.
我们通过自己的人生经验学习。
The mistakes we made are for a reason.
我们犯错是有原因的。
They are for us to learn which is the right way and which is the wrong way.
这些（错误）让我们学会哪些是正确的方式，哪些是错误的方式。
So I guess you could say that in some ways, all this time I was sort of doing yoga but I just didn't realize I was doing it.
从某种意义上说，我在做瑜伽，但我只是没有意识到。
I could remember that I went to the charge of education in the ashram because I thought I didn't be able to start the study due to less experience in yoga.
我记得当我有机会在修习营学习时，我想我没有学习过瑜伽，该如何开始呢？
I asked "what do I have to do before the class". And this big, scared man laughed suddenly and said "You are an old soul, you have being done this for a long time."
我问：“在课前我需要做什么吗？”然后，一个高大威猛的男人突然笑了：“你是一个老灵魂了，你做这些已经很久远了。”
I looked at him and thought I have only done this for 2 classes, I didn't really understand what he meant. That's how I got involved with yoga 20 years ago.
我看着他想到，我才上了两节课，我当时并不理解这句话的意思。而现在我做瑜伽已经20多年了。
And I think still I am studying in the course. I am very happy this all came to me because I never woke up on morning and said "Wow, my life would be good if I go and study yoga and become a yogi or a teacher." This is what I believe in "Something Else".
我想一直在此学习。我很愉快这一切发生在我身上，因为我之前从未想过有天早上醒来说：“我的人生会很好如果我去学瑜伽变成瑜伽士或是老师。”我相信还有一些事指引着我。
Because I think sometimes when you become open to a better way or a positive change or being helpfully useful, it would come to you.
因为我相信当你变得更加敞开一条更好更积极有用有益的变化就会来到。
You just need to be prepared to flow with whatever comes and go to try.
你只需跟随它并且勇于去尝试。
You can't just lie in your lounge in home watching TV with remote control and chocolate biscuits and wait for it comes to you.
当你只是在家看电视吃巧克力时，它是不会到来的。
It won't come that way. But when you are open to things like this, they will come to you.
它不是以那样的方式来到。但是当你像这样敞开，它们就会到来。
But you must be able to realize and grab it. And you must work very hard to make it happen.
但是你必须意识并抓住它。然后，努力把它变为现实。
It very makes me believe that we are not alone.
这让我非常坚信，我们并不孤单。
Once we understand these, it helps to look for our purpose and the reason. I think that is the greatest thing yoga gave me.
一旦我们理解这些，它会帮助我们找到人生的目的。这是瑜伽带给我最好的事情。
It makes me connect to these ideas that we are born for a reason and for a purpose.
我与此联结，明白了此生的意义。
And even though maybe we don't understand what this is, it's part of our life to keep trying to discover this.
或者我们还未理解这意味着什么，那么余生我们将不断的尝试去发现。
联结内在，追随此心
Q: So it's not like a decision after weighing out pros and cons, but more as following you heart?
问：所以这不是权衡利弊的决定，更多的是听从内心的决定？
A: We've been talking about watching and feeling in meditation class, and when we connect with this aspect of ourselves it is the witness. It's like we are connecting with the one real truth and reality.
答：我们在冥想课上讨论过观察和觉知，当我们与内在联结就像我们与真理和实相联结一般。
It's like we can feel that something is correct and something is not.And this is how it works for me with yoga.
就像我们可以感知什么是对，什么是错一样。这就是瑜伽的工作。
I didn't really know but something inside me said "Yes, go and try this".
我并不是很明白，不过在我内心深处有个声音对我说：“是的，去尝试一下。”
It wasn't my mind and it wasn't my conscious decision, it's my heart.
这个不是我的想法，不是我理性的决定，它来自我内心。
And looking back now, I could remember the guy who said to me "You are an old soul, you have done this before".
回想起来，我依然记得有人和我说过：“你是一个老灵魂，你之前就是做这个的。”
That makes me think that when I came back to this situation, I recognized it not consciously but inside myself recognized and said "It takes you 40 years but finally you have come back to what you are meant to be".
我常常回想当时的情景，我意识到那不是来自头脑而是来自我的内心：“你用了四十多年终于回归到你命中注定做的事情了。”
And I think when you find or believe you are on the right track, it gives you a lot of strengths.
我想当你找到或是相信自己在正确的道路上时，这会给你很多能量。
Because it's like for a long time you'd been wandering around in the desert, around and around, and suddenly one day you came to the end of it and you could see the green field and it's like now I could move quickly because I know where I am going.Within the desert you'd just wander in the circle and lost. That's sort of how I feel it.
就像你长时间在沙漠里打转，一天当你突然看到绿洲，你会快速的朝他走去，因为你知道你将去往何处。当你在沙漠中你只是不断的迷失和打转。我的感觉就是这样。
一不小心，变成老师
Q: How did you end up becoming a yoga teacher?
问：那你最后是如何变成瑜伽老师的？
A: I sort of became a teacher by accident. At the end of 3 years yoga course they gave me a piece of paper and said "You have passed all the test, now you are a teacher".
我成为瑜伽老师绝对是个意外。当我结束了3年的瑜伽学习，他们（修习营）给了我一页纸，然后说：“你通过了所有测试，现在你是一名老师了。”
（They don't say "congratulation ". )
(他们竟然没有说“恭喜”，闲人乱入）
I said "I don't want to be a teacher".
我说“我不想成为老师啊。”
They said "Well, you are a teacher, now go and teach these classes, we need teachers."
他们说：“那个，你现在是老师了，现在去上课吧，我们需要老师。”
So I decided to teach. To my surprise, I found that I could do it.
所以我决定去教学了。让我很吃惊的是，我发现自己能做到。
And I could see teaching as a way to do of my Guru told me.
这正验证了上师告诉我的方法。
Once I asked him how to help people. He said "You would help in the way that is you.So there is not any one way. You will find a way."
一次我问他如何帮助他人。他说：“你就是一切的答案，这里没有任何方法，你要自己寻找。”
You will must look at your strength and weakness.
你必须看到自己的优缺点。
But always I was attracted to teaching people.
但始终我为教学而着迷。
I used to go to the prison to teach criminals for 10 years.
我曾经有十年是在监狱教犯人。
I learnt a lot of things teaching in there. Most of them were teenagers, very strong, violent and angry.
我在那里学到很多教学的事情。那里大多数是未成年人，他们强壮、愤怒还有暴力。
I didn't teach these guys how to do handstand or backward bend, they weren't interested in that, but they were interested in someone caring about them and someone showing them positive ways to grow and improve.
我不教他们如何头倒立或是后弯，他们对那些没兴趣。他们关心是否有人在乎他们，让他们成长与进步。
And I had to talk to them like they were and it sort of helped because I was a strong guy with tattoos or something that they understood.
我需要像他们一样说话，让他们理解我，我强壮的身体和纹身帮了不少忙。
They would look at me and think this guy talks like a girl, he talks about his heart but he looks like one of us, what's going on?
他们看着我，可能会觉得我讲心灵之类的像个女孩，可是我又和他们一样，怎么回事呢？
It's maybe 10 or 15 of these big guys sitting in the class and they'd always liked fighting with each other in the class.
当时有10-15个大小伙坐在教室里，看起来随时都能打一架。
In any moment I thought they would attack me or something but they never did. I can remember the day that these guys accepted me that's when they can start to learn from me.
有那么几次我觉得他们会袭击我，然而这并未发生过。我依然记得他们接受我并真正开始学习的那天。
One day 2 of the guards came to the door of the class who were big guys with guns. They knocked on the door and came in and asked me whether they could come in to do the yoga class.
一天，两个高大的配枪狱警敲开教室的门问我，他们能不能来这学瑜伽。
And I looked at the guards and said "You are gonna have to ask the boys whether you could come in. It's their class."
我看着狱警和他们说，你们应该问问这些小伙子，这是他们的瑜伽课。
The guards looked at me and said "No!No!No! I want to come do the class".
I said "Yes!Yes!Yes! You have to ask them. It's their class."
狱警说：“不对！不对！不对！我们想上你的课。”
我说：“对的！对的！对的！你要问他们，这是他们的课程。”
Then the guard asked "Ok, boys, we wanna come do the yoga class."
然后狱警说：“好吧，伙计们，我们想上瑜伽课。”
I said "You have to ask them properly."
我说：“你需要礼貌一点。”
"Pls. can we come to your class?" The guard asked again and looked at me unhappily.
“请问，我们能来上课吗？”狱警又问了一遍，然后生气的看着我。
The boys got together and talked to each other. And then they came and said "It's ok boss(they used to call me boss). These guys can come. They are not too bad." So the guards took the guns off and sat down and did yoga class.
这些男孩聚在一起讨论了一会。然后和我说：“这个可以有老板，通常他们都是叫我老板。这几个人还不错，可以一起上课。”所以，这些狱警卸了枪，和大家一起上课。
At the end of this class, the boy who was like the ringleader came up to me and shook my hand.
课程结束后，一个看起来像头目的男孩过来和我握手。
He said "Thank you very much for that teaching. That is the first time these guards have ever showed us any kindness or respect. We appreciate that."
他说：“谢谢你的教学。这是第一次这些狱警像我们表达友善和接纳，我们很感激。”
From that day, I got on really good with these guys. They just like accepted me and we made a lot of good progress. And I stayed and worked with those guys every week for 10 years.
从那时起，我真正赢得了他们的心，他们接受了我并取得了很大的进步。我每周都会到那上课，一直坚持了十年。
你快乐吗？我很strong
A: Will you call yourself a happy man?
问：你认为自己快乐吗？
Q: I think I'm content. I don't like to use the word "happy". Because sometimes I am not happy but I need to come to accept happiness and no happiness are part of my life.
答：我想我是个容易满足的人。我不喜欢用“快乐”这个词。因为有时我并不快乐。我需要接受快乐与否都是生命中的一部分。
Your expectations must be realistic. If you think that every moment of your life can be happy in anyway because of something you have or something you do, you are going to be disappointed.
你可以如此希望。如果你认为做什么或是拥有什么可以让生活时时快乐的话，那么你肯定会失望。
I very believe you must be realist in your world in this life. And you must see that life is not a way just of happiness, fun and prettiness etc. It can be dirty, ugly or very difficult.
我认为你必须认清现实。生活不只是快乐、有趣和美好，它还有脏乱、丑陋和艰难。
But you would come to see that sometimes these times of difficulty is way you learn the most.
但是，你必须知道艰难是让你学习的机会。
And times of difficulty will make you rise up and become better and stronger until overcome obstacles.
历经艰难，你才会成长强壮。
So in this way, obstacles are good things. I think when you open to this, you can take things more in your stride in your life. That's the strength I've talked about.
从这个角度看，阻碍是件好事，如果你能如此理解，你的生活将会更加从容。这就是我说的力量。
It means your inner self is very strong. Because your inner self doesn't care about what other people think which is the most of us are very connected to.
这意味着你的内在非常强大。因为在内在你将不在意别人怎么看你。
If you know you are good and strong, you are good and strong. And if you believe you are good and strong you can do anything.
如果你认为自己优秀和强大，你就是如此。如果你深信这点，你可以做任何事情。
喵，我的灵魂伴侣在哪？
文末八卦，我知道你们只想看这个…
Q: Is it a must to be single as a Swami?
问：做Swami需要单身吗？
A: No. I can get married if I want to but I never find anyone who can put up with me.
答：不是，我可以结婚，如果遇到合适的。
But I think that the idea with marriage is probably you would only have one person. You wouldn't have many wives or girlfriends.
但是，我想结婚对象只能是一个。你不会有很多老婆或是女朋友。
So I would probably marry somebody that thought the same ideas and we could support and help to grow with each other like a team member.
所以，我可能会娶一个相同价值观，互相支持与成长的人，更像一个团队成员一样。
I don't ever look for marriage. I have many opportunities to be married but I never met right person.
我没有强求婚姻。我有很多机会可以结婚，但是我从没有遇到对的人。
Or when I thought that I had met the right person they didn't want to have anything to do with me.
也许，我遇到了，而对方并不觉得我是那个人。
But I see it sometimes if I had got married 10 or 20 years ago, I wouldn't be in China now.
但是，有时我又在想如果十年，二十年前我就结婚了话，我现在也不可能在中国。
So it comes back to that the universe will guide you to where you meant to be.
所以宇宙会指引我何去何从。
And as far as marriage is concerned, if it comes it comes, if it doesn't come it doesn't come.
就婚姻而言，得者，我幸，不得，我命。
I believe that universe will decide when that would come or happen. I am just open on that subject.
我相信宇宙会决定什么应该发生或是到来。我只需全然接受。
Q: Have you ever met your soul mate?
问：那您遇到过灵魂伴侣吗？
A: Maybe I have. I think I have met some people who I felt very comfortable with.
答：应该有吧。我想我遇到一些让我很舒服的人。
Usually I think it is my soul mate after they have gone. And I looked back and I think maybe she was my soul mate.
一般来讲，我想他们是我的灵魂伴侣吧，他们就离开了。回想起来我觉得她应该是。
I think if I have found my soul mate I would want to be with them all the time.
我想如果我找到自己的灵魂伴侣，我想一直和她在一起。
But also you must be their soul mate. We always look at marriage in the point of view of what makes me happy but it takes two people to be married.
但是你自己必须是她的灵魂伴侣。我通常会考虑婚姻能不能让我快乐，而忘了这是两个人的事情。
So you must find someone not only you want to be with but they actually want to be with you in the same way.
所以，你必须找一个你喜欢她，她也同样喜欢你的。
It's very difficult. It's must be a two-way street. It's must be an equal partnership that you can both benefit and grow.
这很难，它需要是双行道，是一个平等的伴侣关系使双方都能受益和成长。
If it is meant to come and it will bring benefits then it will come. I don't worry about anything like that.
如此为双方带来增益，它就会到来，不用担心。
I love the Chinese saying of "Be like water." and I have a tattoo of 水on my arm. When I heard about it I just smiled.
我喜欢中国的那句老话，从善如流（上善若水）当我听到这句话时会心一笑，而我也纹了一个中国的水字在手臂上。
Because that's how I think I live my life. I will flow with and life will take me.
因为，这也是我的认为的人生，我将顺应人生的起伏。
I am not smart enough to know where I am supposed to be or supposed to be doing like most of people are.
我不是很聪明，知道如何做什么或是怎么做招人喜欢。
But I very trust and believe in the universe and the path I'm on and what I'm doing.
我非常信任宇宙和自己的道路。
How do I know it's right? My spirit tells me and I just feel that it is right. It just feels natural in good way.
如何知道这是对的？我的灵魂感知并告诉我的，这是自然的直觉。
Not easy but I just feel it is what I'm meant to do. So it's the same thing like if someone comes and I get married, I will still have to be able to do what I am doing.
不容易，我只是直觉的知道自己该做什么。同样的，如果我结婚，我还是要做我该做的事情。
If it comes, it is meant to come, the water will flow in that direction. If it doesn't come, that means it was not going to be suitable to help me in my working.
它来，意味着合适，会带我走入那个方向。它不来，意味着这些于我的工作无益。
Yoga is all about getting you the directions. Like I see this spiritual path as my purpose in life that's what I should try to stay focus on.
瑜伽引领我走入那个方向，就像灵性指引我前行一样，我所要做的就是专注于此。
Anything that takes me away from this is a distraction. And I should try to limit the distractions in my life.
任何让我分心的事情，我都必须小心。
You have to live life and be part of life but try to live with focus on this spiritual path this yoga path.
你可以自由的过一生，但是试着专注于灵魂之路，这也是瑜伽之路。
简介
Swami Mantramurti is an initiated Swami in the Dashnami tradition of Indian Sannyasa. Mantra has more than 15 years training, practice and experience in teaching these practices and caring for the needs of students who wish to learn and benefit from them. He has been teaching these practices to Chinese students in many different parts of China over the past 6 years. He is currently a full time professional teacher for Le Yoga.
斯瓦米.曼德拉穆提是印度Sannyasa 瑜伽学派Dashnami传统有授课资质认证的学者。斯瓦米.曼德拉穆提拥有超过15年的练习、培训及教学经验，他能够因材施教。在过去的6年中，他曾在中国许多不同地区把这些知识教授给中国学生。目前他是乐瑜伽的全职专业老师。
Namaste.
延伸阅读：
